Soggy Crust

[Tony Pizzeria]

I fired up the 2-stone twice now and used 4 different recipes, the oven temp was at 725, flour was KA Bread pies cooked in about 2 1/2 minutes they looked great, only problem was that were kinda soggy, not a good crisp to the crust. If I cooked them any longer the bottom would have burnt. I went on the pizza forum for help and no one ever ran into this problem just wondering if you can make any suggestions. I also put the skirts all around and tried door open and door closed and half open.
Any help appreciated I really love this oven and know that it will produce a GREAT pizza with time.
Would taking out all the flavor bars on the Weber Genesis help?

[Willard]

Good questions Tony,
I'll be back in a while, and will try to
answer some of them - willard

[Tony Pizzeria]

Thanks Willard, no big rush whenever you get a chance

[Tony Pizzeria]

I tried taking out the flavor bars today and did a pie in 2.5 minutes but again a litle soggy (but better) but the bottom was burnt black. I also have been reading all the threads on the oven when it started and was wondering if some of the problem is that I dont have a fibrament stone, as the pies are sticking to the stone you sent. Again no rush just trying to give you all the info. I know it has to be something I am doing or I don't have as all the threads I read are so positive and mine seems to be the only problem. I know that my Weber is old, but I just cleaned it real good before I got the stone, and it does run very hot, close to 900. Also I do not have bar to hold up the hood, can I get one locally or is this something I need to get from you.
PS If it is easier I will gladly call you when you time permits to get this solved
Thanks
Tony

[Lloyd Lande]

whats the hydration on your dough? how much sauce are you putting on the pizza? are you drying the mozz with paper towels before applying? are you putting too many toppings on?

This are the typical causes of soggy crust..

[Tony Pizzeria]

I have used 4 different recipes that I have made before, not putting to much sauce or topping, I don't use a lot of topping at all and the Mutzi was dry. But as I said the bottom gets burnt to a black color also so It's cooking to fast.

[Tony Pizzeria]

Hydration is between 60-65% and i used 4 recipes before and never got a soggy crust. I have done all the above and I never use a lot of toppings I grew up with NY style when all you could get was cheese or anchovies. I left the last pie on longer to see if I underbaked but the bottom got black

[Tony Pizzeria]

Thanks for the thoughts Lloyd I appreciate it

[Willard]

I'm back Tony,

I share your dislike for soggy crust, so I'll try to share some of the things I have learned.

One of the first things I have learned and I think many people share the same experience, is that I actually don't like pizza baked at 800-900 deg. that much, or rather I like a crisper more structured crust better. If you are going to bake in the high temp ranges with the 2stone there are some simple rules.

1. The dough formulation has to suit high heat, so a Caputo or a similar formula will give you the best results.

2. The hydration levels needs to be high and no sugar is needed. If you are having sticking problems you can flour the dough with a semolina / flour mix when stretching it out.

3. The pizza needs to be pulled out so it is paper thin (like a credit card or less) Cut your dough ball down to a 6-7 oz ball for a 10"-11" pie.

4. Apply the sauce sparingly, and when you put cheese and toppings on leave open spots for the sauce to evaporate. The cheese acts as a moisture barrier and can seal off the evaporation of the sauce if there is too much. If you really want it dried out put the sauce and some toppings on first without the cheese and burn the moisture off for the first min and apply the cheese for the last part of the bake. (if you do this you will be surprised how fast the cheese will melt on the second half of the bake because much of the moisture is burned off and the surface the cheese is being applied to is already hot)

5. Start baking at much lower (stone) temps. The air is hotter and your stone is a cordierite (thinner) stone so it is also being heated up all the time from the bottom. Start baking at 650 stone and work your way up. Once you hit the ceiling on the stone temp where the bottom is coming out the way you want it together with the top, you will be able to tweak it even further with your dough formulation. (at this stage personal experience and trial and error are the only reliable methods to use, because small nuances in the way you do things can have a significant impact on the end results)

6. All environments are different so at some stage of the game your situation is unique unto yourself and so what works for me may simply not work for you (variations in humidity ambient temperature and grill configurations prohibit the implementation of sweeping, hard and fast rules)

In the end High temp baking is totally different. You will slowly pick up the instincts you will need to get it right on a regular basis.This is what makes it challenging, fun and so rewarding when you finally start pulling out great pizza.

I have by now literally baked hundreds if not thousands of pizzas in the 2stones and am just now getting a solid grasp on how it all works. I hope some of what I shared will help.

Yes I would take out all the flavor bars and get as much unimpeded air flow as possible. You can also use a block of wood to prop your hood open ( it may burn up eventually, but it won't absorb heat the way a metal object will and will be easy to move without burning yourself) Also.... your stone will become seasoned after a while and you won't have the sticking problems so much.

regards,
willard

[Willard]

I see Lloyd covered many of the same things I did. You will start finding success if you START YOUR STONE OUT AT "650F" AND GO UP FROM THERE. - keep us posted -wg

[Tony Pizzeria]

Ok I will try to use a lower heat and all the other factors you mentioned. But in your opinion would the Fibrament work better, I may spring for one if you think it would help

[Tony Pizzeria]

I really do not want to use the caputo flour as I have been using KA and love it. I would like to try the recipe I saw of your pies using all purpose, if you can send it to me.
Thanks

[Willard]

Yes the Fibrament stone is more stable and forgiving. It is thicker and has less of an edge to it (it is not as dense a material as the cordierite) but if you lower the temp you can get excellent results with your stone. The stone I sent you is not a cheap one, and is a better grade stone than the one that originally came with the $199.00 version.
I also like KA AP and other AP brands for that matter. I will be doing a step by step recipe of my AP version which I will be posting here soon. - willard